The Whore and her Mother
9/11, Babylon and the Return of the King
by Raymond McCullough
comments on the book & podcast
Responses to this book from Authonomy.com, etc.
July 16, 2011
very compelling....and profound....am planning on rereading as there’s too much to absorb in one read through....looking forward to rereading...thanks so much for putting it altogether and putting it out there....
Nikki Nafziger (USA)
July 10, 2011
When I perused your pitch, my brain immediately went into "profile" mode. I had concluded that your book was a throwback to the traditional biblical prophecy in which so many of we as believers have been entrenched for years; my initial radar told me the book was a simplistic throwback to the 80’s - the Roman Catholic Church is the whore of Babylon; the Pope is the Antichrist, yada, yada, yada. This preconception was not in a little way reinforced by the in-your-face title.
Boy was I AMAZED when I read this book, and I pretty darn near read the whole thing in one setting which I very rarely do! I am in awe of your extensive knowledge on so many levels: Christian, Jewish, and Muslim culture; the Jewish diaspora; your knowledge of Greek and Hebrew; and your panoramic view of history through a biblical worldview.
Yes, the content is thought-provoking and troublesome, and many will be offended, but you consistently build your case instead of being sensationalistic.
Kudos on on this book and blessings to you.
June 22, 2011
Fantastic opening. Very well written!!
Funny, of course I remember exactly when I saw a building on TV with smoke coming out the window... A few minutes later, as I watched, the second plane hit the 2nd tower.... I was up all night then... (cause it started around 11pm where I am in Australia). What a horrifying thing to have happened... I remember last year on 9/11, I asked my children if they remembered it... And they didn't!!!!!!!!!!!!! We aren't in America, I suppose, and one of them wasn't born at the time... but it was strange how quickly kids forget - maybe there's too many tragedies...
In the intro, you start by saying, "This book is aimed at christians...." I understand that you've qualified this, and also added to the list with other religions, but I think you should leave that whole bit out. Aren't you aiming the book for everyone?
And I wouldn't call God G-d. Do you think people appreciate that? I'm not sure. I don't think the word 'god' is offensive... I'd just come out and call him that. Alternatively, find a different word like "The Universal Spirit" or "Jehovah" or something that is an actual word rather than g-d. The g-d really is throwing me all the way through...I don't like it!!! :)
I would be wary of using 'christian' words like 'fellowship'.
I like how you get straight to the point in chapter 3, and also that you undline the relevant bits in the bible passages.
World Trade Center. I never thought it was about trading, I thought they were office blocks. I realise that offices of money markets and FX and all that were in there, but were there shops and trading of goods like clothing? And if there was this trading, then what makes those office blocks different from others and unique enough to be prophesied about in the bible??
Hm, interesting stuff!! I'm tired at the moment.... forgive me if I wrote something silly!!! I'll have to come back and take another look at this later... Good work, and highly rated.
Read chapters 1 to 3. This is a thoughtful, insightful book and you have a knack for putting complicated topics in an easily accessible way. I believe that the Prophets do have a lot to teach us and to warn us of. Where I differ is that I do not believe that they are offering us a blueprint of our age or of the future. The human capacity for pattern guides us into seeing what is not always there, like an optical illusion effect. As a historian I see in the past many times where people have believed the end times to be coming and read the portents as such. It will come, but as a thief in the night, without prior warning. Thanks for providing a thought-provoking interlude though. :)
You know your bible extremely well and you pose many interesting questions and your Christian faith clearly shines through. Your first person narrative voice coupled with your straight-forward writing style is perfect for this genre of book. Backed with pleasure.
I love reading this kind of stuff, but wouldn’t dare to write about it myself. The Bible is full of controversies and it could be interpreted any which way. Who is right and who is not, it's anybody’s guess. Your writing provokes some thinking and that’s good, shows the depth, it’s not just two dimensional which is difficult to acheive with any type of writing let alone with this topic that could easily turn into another flat lecture.
Bold, daring and thoughtful. Poignant. Timely. Deep and detailed. A noble theme. Top notched writing.
Your command of English is grand, no issues at all there. Your style is clear and easy to read. The scripture excerpts are a bit longish in some cases, but I put that down to your need to show that you are not wrenching anything out of context. You put your argument very clearly. Like one of the folks below, I have doubts about the title - I can’t see the Faith Mission Bookshop displaying it anywhere prominent!
I first had Babylon explained to me in the writings of Hal Lindsey, who reckoned it was a symbol that represented our entire economic system. I have since come around to the opinion that it might mean modern Western civilisation generally, which is based pretty much on acquisitiveness anyway. I feel a bit wary of nailing prophecy down in too detailed a fashion - authors who have done that have often ended up with egg on their faces, from the Jehovah’s Witnesses (who actually dated the return of Christ - 1918, then 1948, then some time in the 1970s) down to the author who specifically identified Henry Kissinger with the Antichrist.
For what it’s worth, my own understanding is that in the end times, believers will come under fierce persecution, and a very specific attempt will be made to discredit God - with great fanfare, apparently incontrovertible proof that Christianity is wrong will be presented, proof which will "if possible, deceive the very Elect," as Paul put it. At that moment certain things will click in the minds of believers who know their Bibles, and they’ll say to themselves, "Ah! So that's what it meant!" They will remember that they were told all this was coming, and know not to place any confidence in the great con; the difficult prophecies will become clear in the light of current events (current for them, that is.)
Yes perhaps God presented the USA with a chance to heal wounds with the Muslim world, through repentance, forgiveness and compassion. Had George W increased aid to Muslim countries, admitted past sins against others and been a true Christian, none of today's problems (Iraq, Afghanistan, Gaza) would be happening.
He really missed the boat.
Best wishes and good luck,
Hi Raymond, This appears to have a direct and well-founded theme. The fact that the author has sustained violence himself accounts for the committed tone. I hadn’t thought about The World Trade Center and the prophesies in Revelations before but you’ve supported this well with scripture and brought to light a central site of the great city. It’s very thought-provoking and solidly presented.
WONDERFUL! Enthusiastically backed, and I hope to return for more reading later. This is a book that I’ll give away to friends and foes if it gets published.
D George (SingingOwl)
You have taken on a big big subject here and one I am very interested in and have studied since I was a kid. You seem very well informed and able to see things that would often be hidden to many others. I will enjoy reading this but have to say from what I have read so far this has the makings of a Best seller in its field. The key is that you open up real ideas some of which are somewhat scary to say the least. I find it difficult to leave down because you have created the "Must turn the page" feeling threaded right through every line. Fantastic work and typical of an Irish Writer!
Colin T Mercer
Hi Raymond, this is an important book and I will be back to read more once I have got up to date with my read list. I am retired and now a security consultant. 9/11 could have been thwarted if the FBI and CIA had worked closer together and not in competition. The NSA didn’t do too well either. They failed to interpret a message about the attacks they received a day or two before.
You summon all sorts of feelings and emotions in the reader with this story. Good - at least you get a reaction and the reader is moved - whether positively or negatively is another issue but this is certainly attention-getting! " ‘9/11, Babylon and the Return of the King!’ Did Hebrew prophets foretell 9/11? Are they relevant today? 'Mega-Babylon' - where? " Your underlying themes are soooooooo relevant. I like to think for myself and don’t like people preaching to me - especially about what the Good Book says. But I agree, the prophets of old have had useful things to tell us - and "Should we pay attention to their words?" as you ask at the end of your opening. Why not? I close no doors so I’ll be back to read when I have some more time. Best of luck.
This is fascinating, a must read for all people. lf you write this well, you could have a surprise hit. The events of 11/09/2001 was of biblical scale. Was it predicted in the bible? l don’t know, but the fall of Babylon comes to mind...l shall read on.
I know exactly where I was on 9/11, it’s my birthday and my first birthday with the woman who would become my wife, This is an interesting pitch which touches on if there is no freewill we are screwed or are we so primitive that we allow ourselves to be bowed by primitive fear of writings that we can manipulate to our own lives as easily as the daily horoscope. Very good.
Dear Raymond, I love that you use the scriptures to back up your book - His Word will not return void, but accomplish what it is sent for. :) Have you read Joel Rosenberg’s books? They are amazing, too. Jesus said to watch & be ready. I was prepared to read your book after reading your blurb, preface, & introduction. I’m happy that I know the ending. :) I’ll get to be with my Lord. :) Your story is a good read because you create interest by having short paragraphs & lots of dialogue, which makes me want to keep reading to find out what’s going to happen next.
You invite some interesting questions and write eloquently and with flair. Backed for its passion.
Interesting stuff here. But somehow I feel uneasy, mainly because I am a proud and active Jew.
This book - despite its odd title - is a guide to better spiritual health. The mark of it is your writing style; it’s sincere and thought provoking. There’s a big audience out there for books of this type.
As a work of non-fiction, The Whore and her Mother must be reviewed on rather different criteria from those which apply to various genres of fiction. Thus I liked the structure that sets out the author’s imperatives in a preface and the aims of the book in an Introduction, both of which give the reader a frame of reference from which to evaluate the material. I didn’t much like the emphasis on the author’s beliefs in the introduction, though - not that I challenge them in any way, but they belong IMHO in the preface. The introduction should rather set out the aims and foundations of the book as it does very effectively for example in the later paragraphs concerning the provenance of the biblical texts. I liked in C3 how you settled into the classic structure of setting out facts, exploring differing opinions and reaching specific conclusions - a well tried and tested mathod of exposition that suits this material well. On that basis, though I can make no comment on the conclusions reached, I’ll be happy to back this book.
Read all 6 chapters. I remember thinking at the time of 9/11 how similar the events were to the Revelation verses you quote. I would buy this book. Love this kind of stuff. It’s grounded in research and common sense - not like the ‘Left Behind’ series. There is no doubt as to what nation fulfils the role of Mega-Babylon.
Francis Albert McGrath
I have heard for years that the US would fall. If you’re interested, look at Chuck Colson’s New Year's vision that was posted about two years ago. As you are probably aware, there is compelling evidence that the $20 bill foretold 9/11. If you haven’t seen it, Google "twenty dollar bill twin towers." Folding the bill one way shows the Twin Towers in flames; the opposite way shows smoke rising from the Pentagon. Since 9/11 I’ve looked for a book that detailed the backgrounds of the hijackers, how they formed a liason with Ben Laden, and why no one in the US stopped them. Divine judgement seems to be the only answer.
I enjoyed this read very much. It certainly got me thinking.
I believe there is something or someone out there greater than us all....But I don’t know what his name is....
Religion has made both martyrs and eejits out of man since the beginning of time....If you can shed some light on the whole shabang then fabulous...
That said, it’s your writing I’m commenting on, which I have to say is very eloquent.......I did not feel you were preaching at all, more laying your cards on the table and it was up to me what to make of the hand in front of me.....An evocotive read, which left me ‘thoughfull’
This is a most thought provoking work of non-fiction, meticulously researched and written with style and passion.
In your preface you question why the world’s most powerful nation was powerless to prevent such an evil attack, then you say that you accept that for his own reasons, God allowed it to happen. But wasn’t this perhaps the moment to question why these people committed this evil act. I have not read enough to know whether you do this later, but to me the burning question is - why did they do it? Not why didn’t this powerful nation prevent it. People don’t commit acts like that unless they are driven to it. Action and reaction.
I think that any book that provokes the kind of debate you have aroused on this site is an important book. Especially when it is so well written and presented. And so convincingly researched.
A compelling read.
With best wishes, and good luck.
Hi Raymond. From the pitch I wasn’t sure this would interest me. I read mostly fiction nowadays. But, right from the start I could see you were presenting ideas that I hadn’t really contemplated myself. I spend many hours rolling similar ideas around in my head but with no serious continuity so what you’ve compiled here is a kind of guide for my own contemplations. (ok, I know that didn’t make a lot of sense... but it did to me...haha)
Anyway, it’s apparent you’ve delved into this deeply and passionately. Your presentation is clear, concise - very easy to follow and understand. I think it deserves attention. On my shelf and the best of luck with it.
John Harold McCoy
I found this an intriguing book. Not necessarily one I would read myself but certainly one that would interest a lot of people. You write easily and clearly and have obviously put a huge amount of thought and study into this. I do wonder about your use of G-d. I know in the Hebrew tradition one avoids spelling out the God names but it’s the first time I’ve come across a Christian doing it. Just curious.
I don’t agree with your premise but it’s well argued and I’m happy to back you.
Good writing, excellent topic. I will back it on that. The pitch reminded me of a book I read about 25 years ago by a man named Hal Lindsey (I think that is his name). Actually it was 2 books. The Late Great Planet Earth, and Rapture. As I read this the similarities drifted but the idea is the same. How do we interpret the message of the biblical prophets to today’s events. I think your message will stike a note with many and will have an audience, but the way I read it, it wouldn’t hurt to try to make it a more entertaining read. As it is now it reads like a text. Just a suggestion, and my opinion.
Your passion is so apparent in this. You’ve woven it with great care and I hope it serves as a source for those who want to and need to connect. Best of luck w it!
I thought this was going to be an erotica book from the title. HA!
This rubs me the wrong way. I am being blunt here. I know.
For I do not believe God is in control of humans, humans are in control of themselves. The only way God could have prevented the event of 911 was if he grabbed the planes out of the sky and gently set them down at the airport, then took the terrorists in his mighty hand and spanked them. They say religious motives drove the terrorists, but that is not true, only one thing drives terrorists, hatred. God cannot do anything about hatred, it exists in the world. He gave us free will, and we can execute it as we please. The reverse side is that we have to suffer the consequences of that freewill. Like watching towers fall and people die. (or watching years of oppression in war torn Northern Ireland.)
I don’t like George Bush, I don’t, he was a shitty president who did a stupid thing. A war on terror? No such thing. Terrorists come in all forms, as you would know being from Northern Ireland, and one cannot execute a war on them. One has to be a complete fool to think they could fight a war on terror, let alone to think they could win! That said, how could he announce a day of repentance when he governs a country that are birthing more atheists day in and day out? Not only that but saying you have religion, saying you have faith is one thing, actually having it is another. I doubt many "religious" people actually even have religion.
The part about what your family went through is awful. Honestly I feel compassion for the struggles that you went through, and if believing it was God's will helps you, if that is what you believe than I respect that. For me I wouldn’t be able to do this. Horrible things happen in this world every day, if those are the things that are God’s will then I cannot believe in a God that allows those things.
It seems I have ranted. OOOOPS.
I suppose your book is good. Look at the diatribe I just went on?
You invoked feeling in me, which I guess means that your book, which is non-fiction, served a purpose. Not only that but this is the longest comment I have ever left.
Your writing is up to snuff. This is a tough subject. One I imagine would rub people the wrong way, not imagine, KNOW. I know this will rub people the wrong way. That said, I also know my opinion is only that, my opinion. I also know that this book will resonate well with others.
I admire your faith, for I doubt I could hold onto it if people were throwing bricks through my window. Good luck with this.
Speaking as someone with a morbid belief in world-ending armageddon The Whore and her Mother’s just grist to my mill!
This is different from most of the other books on this site. I skimmed quickly through the first three chapters and found the writing clear and concise. It’s a difficult topic to approach objectively and raises some interesting questions. All the best with it.
You argue your case with intelligence and conviction, and this book is a useful contribution to the debate on the validity of predictions and other forms of sooth-saying. You clearly know your subject, and the high standard of your writing lends this book extra credibility. Best wishes,
I can see you’ve gone into this at full pelt. You’ve spent a good few years analysing His Word and you’ve unleashed a whole indepth ‘truth seeker’s’ Question Time style debate. A lot of research has gone into this. Done well and you’re standing your ground.
Raymond - what a fascinating idea. Your writing is good and you’ve certainly done your research. My only quibble would be to cut down on the number of exclamation marks.
Although not my field of interest, I myself refer to the Bible (new testament) as a text with some exellent morals and ethical lessons to live by. Anyone is free to interpret this work as he/she deems to apply it to themselves.
Your writing shows extensive research and thought in the presentation of your ideas. Anyone with theological interests would do well to read your arguments for opinion and debate.
BTW - very catchy title!
A book I feel, of the times we live with. A story of wars and corruption, a re-enactment of the eras of empire. Of the book of Revelations, its multiple revisions or misinterpretations, the quotations from the more than 2500 versions of an original message from the ages, their use and abuse. As a means of enforcement or persuasion, quotations ever rewarding as incentives to a world at peace with itself, released from its corruption and violence. The whole story giving a sense of a different world, also related to the other option, a world of hope and shared dreams realised.
Wow. This was very different from anything I’ve read on Authonomy, yet I was so impressed with the level of detail you give and your breadth of knowledge on the subject. The events of 9/11 have allowed many to theorize about its greater implications, but few have been as well-researched and thorough as you have. Excellent work.
Kevin Alex Baker
This is great! I am an old fan of Hal Lindsay and your writing reminds me of him. I am happy to help this work along by giving it a place on my shelf :)
David :) (Mascutt)
As others know I love this sort of stuff; from Icke to Keel to Anton Wilson and dozens more, I devour the stuff like I gobbled up this.
I think this is a must read for anyone with faith.. well written and great analysis. Will come to read more.
Raymond - this is a very intriguing piece, expertly researched, brilliantly delivered. Your wonderful writing style pulls it all together nicely. Well done - enthusiastically backed!
I put your book on my w/l simply because I liked your title! I had no idea what it was about or that it was non-fiction. I’m not sure what I was expecting but it wasn’t expecting a book like this - in the best sense.
As others have said, your prologue is thought provoking. I remember exactly what I was doing that day… It is way out of my area for normal reads so only got up to chapter 4, but you can see the amount of time and research you’ve out into this - I am in no way qualified to say how accurate it is :O)
You ask your reader some interesting and uneasy questions, good for you!
This is gripping, sir. Very well done. I too am of the Christian faith, so I welcome your points of view and am anxious to read more.
I'm afraid I'm not a believer, I wish I were. However, I judge a book on its quality of writing, and this book is well written, clear and easy to follow, if only more were like it.
Brilliant prologue that embraces the thoughts of many. You write well and create an interesting and thought provoking scenario. It deserves to be read by everyone if only to stimulate their thoughts and possibly their future actions.
Ron A Sewell
Fascinating stuff, and so refreshing that you're not trotting out the old nonsense about the RC church being the great prostitute! I wish you good luck with this. You seem to know your stuff and this comes across while reading.
Hi Raymond, interesting argument so far - more so in view of the dire effects of the current Global recession. I wonder did you know that the current era of the world is called Kali Yuga by the Hindus (= the age of Kali - she's the black goddess who has a necklace of skulls and presides over dissolution and destruction).
It's defined as an era when materialism overrides all else and the social, ethical and moral rules of society crumble.
Similarly there are those who interpret the timeline for Nostrdamas' prophecies of a time of chaos and destruction as indicating the start of the current millennium!
So there is some support for your argument from sources other than the "People of the Book". It's well researched and written as others have already said and it's brave of you to tackle it. Even though as a journalist I've written about and read the core texts of all the main faiths (and a few others!) I don't feel qualified to comment on whether you're right or not, however.
But I will be interested in how your argument develops.
A raw and controversial subject, bravely faced and articulately presented.
Although I think you do have an ability to write, I struggle with your subject matter. It is something that leaves me feeling uneasy. Not something that I can embrace. That being said I still wish you well with it.
This is fascinating...excellent research......on my shelf. The kind of book that can become an obsession. lots of luck with it
I will comment on the quality of your writing and research, the particular slice of human experience that you have detailed knowledge about is not something I can comment on and as for divining the future, I think I will give that a miss too. What I found here was a compellingly written piece of persuasive writing that makes a strong case for its main tenets. You write very well and very clearly about a range of topics, clear thinking in terms of exposition with a number of key arguments and inside its own terms this book works fine. Whatever my view of the content can be put to one side in the process of appreciating your writing talent. Well done for that sir.
Hi Raymond, think you've done great justice to your subject matter ,and really hope you get this published.
I have read all that you have uploaded and find the subject matter fascinating. I think that your assumptions based on references to ancient texts adds some authenticity to the read and remind me of the style of Holy Blood/ Holy Grail, that spawned research work for such as Dan Browns the Davinci Code. (Allegedly) ha ha.
This is the sort of book that I would buy. My only critique is that you have not uploaded the entire book, which would save me some money for when I have to buy it after you find a publisher.
Having said all that, you seem like the sort of guy I could debate with for ever and a day over a few pints, regarding the authenticity of ancient writings, for which I have little faith, after studying ancient religions pre dating the bible and from which many stories seem to have been adopted for the bible.
The study of the Babylon concept has been an ongoing project of mine for some time but I have never found such a well-researched and accessible book on the subject as this. Nicely done!
read till ch 6, but would be interested to see more.
is the usa really as der spiegel said in 97 still the only dominant nation? china seems to have far more reserves and hidden power.
i wonder where your conclusions lead you. . ?
shelved for raising significant issues.
This is waaaaay beyond me! I have had a nose through, and I can pick up on a few of your points, but I'm afraid your intelligence and understanding way surpasses that of my own. Nevertheless, from what I can comment on, I am pleased to say that this is a highly knowledgeable and well researched book.
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